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User talk:Kunarian/National Guard Act 2012
In my opinion, this should not be named the Armed Forces and should not be a separate department, as we only have a sort of national guard-like thing. Lovia can't afford an armed forces. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 01:25, December 22, 2011 (UTC) I haven't even written anything on the armed forces yet, wait a while! Believe me, Lovia can afford a military with what I am planning and plus we have been doing ok without taxes. I mean we should wait until we get taxes sorted and until I can write some more. It is subject to change and would not hurt to be tested at some point as it is a temperory act. Kunarian 01:51, December 22, 2011 (UTC) The Armed forces should be part of the police and be more for peace and defence. Granero 02:10, December 22, 2011 (UTC) Agreed. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 02:11, December 22, 2011 (UTC) The armed forces do not come under police and are and will be for peace and defence much more than the previously presented acts by some of your affliates Granero. Kunarian 02:16, December 22, 2011 (UTC) Lovia does not need separate military, its too small. Granero 02:45, December 22, 2011 (UTC) Says the person who supported a bill that: *Did not truely cap the LDF's power. *Gave the military power over Congress. *Gave all the military to the few who were involved. Lovia needs a military that is like a national guard. Its better to have one and not need it (like I propose), than to not have one and need it (Lovian civil war). Kunarian 02:52, December 22, 2011 (UTC) Lovia needs something that is not called the armed forces that is like the national guard. We should just make it a branch of the police. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 03:01, December 22, 2011 (UTC) I do not believe the defence of the nation falls within the area of the police and that it is important enough to have its own department. Anyways, stop and wait until I start writing about the actual armed forces, who I will rename, the Lovian Nation Guard. Kunarian 03:08, December 22, 2011 (UTC) See what I mean? Told you this is a tough crown to please. And what's with you guys and these "national guards"? I thought you were all against militias, much less an alliance of militias. The biggest problem with a national guard is that they are reserve forces! We need a military not a reserve military, TimeMaster. Plus, we've seen a number of militias rebel against Lovia. -- LCPCOP Christopher Costello (Pikapi - Discuss - ) 03:11, December 22, 2011 (UTC) A military can rebel just as well as any national guard. National Guard is a nicer way of saying Defence Force which is a nicer way of saying Armed Forces. personally by definition I am picking up little aspects of all of them. Kunarian 03:15, December 22, 2011 (UTC) This is coming along fine. Defense or Defence, though? Generally Lovian English is like American English. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 17:45, December 23, 2011 (UTC) I like Defence, but if its American English then I can change them to Defense. Kunarian 18:24, December 23, 2011 (UTC) So your saying that any other military proposal isn't suitable just because we don't give ours the "friendlier" title of "National Guard". This seems incredibly stupid. Also, I hope that you don't plan on copy editing my work-in-progress act. -- LCPCOP Christopher Costello (Pikapi - Discuss - ) 20:10, December 23, 2011 (UTC) Hardly, simply because a military is a huge addon and your act was not thorough enough. And I do not plan on copy editing your work in progress, have I done that thus far? Kunarian 20:14, December 23, 2011 (UTC) You know what, I think Defence is more correct, even though my American spell check disagrees. Noah Webster, you are a bitch. . . you don't just change spelling. If it was "s", there would be no need for a silent e. And militias are banned and unrealistic (how'd they get the guns in the first place??). —TimeMaster (talk • ) 21:12, December 23, 2011 (UTC) Organised or unorganised criminals smuggling weapons in. On the other hand they could just be stealing stuff from Kameron Armaments in their spare time but I doubt it. Hunting weapons are understable though. Kunarian 21:20, December 23, 2011 (UTC) What part of my act suggests that the Lovian Defense Force has power over the Congress? Also, I do not want full control over my military, if it is accepted. I just wish to be able to edit it and have a pretty decent say in what goes. Think of it like this: If you were to get your National Guard approved, wouldn't you want to be able to edit the article and expand on your military? It's the same with the Coastal Police and organizations like that right now. Perhaps you aren't quite familiar with how fiction wiki's work, Kunarian. -- LCPCOP Christopher Costello (Pikapi - Discuss - ) 21:30, December 23, 2011 (UTC) Lovia is an island country so smuggling is quite difficult now with the coastal police. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 21:31, December 23, 2011 (UTC) I think saying it had power over congress was premature as I said afterwards, its the problem that congress does not have power over it. If the National Guard act is approved it is up to the Government of the day to assign a secretary of defence who will be the one who will edit the page accordingly. If the National Guard is approved then I will simply set up the pages. Plus it won't be MY military it will be Lovia's. Perhaps Pikapi it is you who are unfamiliar with how Lovia works? Kunarian 21:45, December 23, 2011 (UTC) I agree, I didn't really see any things on how to actually get the positions can be appointed into office. For example, the federal police commissioner is appointed by and can be removed by the Secretary of Welfare, but there's nothing of the like in the 11th amendment. And I'm still against the lifetime terms that Jeff added. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 21:52, December 23, 2011 (UTC) My military is Lovia's military. Editors create pages, and articles to document their fiction. Sure, I have to get it approved in order to write that fiction, but that is what makes the military "Lovian". If being Lovian is just doing a bunch of minor things, and suggesting that your superiors do all of the big things in a formal proposal, than it isn't really a wiki. That's being an idiot and giving people your ideas so that they get all of the credit. I am smart enough to know that that isn't what Lovia is all about. I'm making a proposal to create a military. While what you're saying about regular editors not having any real say in Lovia's affairs might sound nice on paper, in the long run, it comes down to what I am saying. I'll put this in simpler terms for everyone to understand: *I'm making a proposal to create a military for Lovia. *You're making a proposal to have another individual (perhaps the PM, who in all truth, is inactive) create a military for us, for Lovia. -- LCPCOP Christopher Costello (Pikapi - Discuss - ) 22:29, December 23, 2011 (UTC) I don't even think Lovia needs an Armed Forces at all, it just could use some sort of National Guard-like service. I also don't understand what the difference you are playing at is. Do you mean that too many things are being set out in stone in this act, unlike yours which is more vague? —TimeMaster (talk • ) 22:37, December 23, 2011 (UTC) I'm simply doing this the way I think it should be done, so stop putting words into my mouth. A military force (in whatever form) is too easily abused without strictly set out guidlines. Regular editors that are not in congress should trust those who they voted for in the elections to deal with the matters of state and be active while doing it. I'll put in in simple words: *You are rushing an act in without due thought and consideration to create a military without proper boundries. *I am writing a well thought and long act to create a military with proper boundries. If you wanted a military so bad, you would not give its supporters bad press by arguing over it in such an unruly manner. You do yourself no favours. 23:23, December 23, 2011 (UTC) This will need big changes after the ministry act is approved...--— Christopher Costello (Pikapi • Chat • ) 15:48, January 6, 2012 (UTC) How so? 16:08, January 6, 2012 (UTC) Kunarian, I think that too much stuff is being routed to the PM in this act. There needs to be more power to the Minister of Defence and Congress for things like appointments and discharges. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 16:35, January 6, 2012 (UTC) : Don't worry I will rectify problems over the weekend and probably finish the act. probably. Kunarian 16:58, January 6, 2012 (UTC) TM, you should think about getting a third party to be Defense minister, if the other 2 can't agree. And also keep in mind that Villanova and Oos have more votes, so one of them may be getting the homors of appointing a minister. HORTON11: • 16:46, January 6, 2012 (UTC) : I appreciate the neutral gesture but who else is interested that is not on my side or Pikapi's? I hope we can talk it out like adults from now on and choose the right one based on policies not arguments. Kunarian 16:58, January 6, 2012 (UTC) Agreed, and Villanova has lost several of his votes. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 17:00, January 6, 2012 (UTC) Intelligence Is there an intelligence agency in here? If not, I'd recommend one. -- 02:27, January 9, 2012 (UTC) There is the Lovian Secret Service, but I think its comedic? Granero 02:55, January 9, 2012 (UTC) Lovia only needs a small intelligence agency. Not many foreign people, or people in Lovia, hate the country. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 03:03, January 9, 2012 (UTC) That is how I feel too. There should be restrictions on who can become members of the intelligence agency. When I was working on my act, I planned it out where members of intelligence had to be either former Lovian soldiers, or meet a lot of specific criteria to ensure no terrorists or anything invade the system. --— Christopher Costello (Pikapi • Chat • ) 15:35, January 9, 2012 (UTC) I'll make another act for the Lovia secret service, if you feel it is very important. I don't feel that they should be a part of the standing military for numerous reasons, the main one being that they aren't a military unit. 17:29, January 9, 2012 (UTC) issues I still see a few issues in your proposeal: #National Guard is not the most appropriate name for this, perhaps something like the JSDF might be better #You refer to "low flying" as an offence but you have not established the branches of the armed forces #there is no real need for a Lovian airforce. Fighter jets are terribly expensive and unnecessary. You should see the issues they are having in Canada with F-35's. #HORTON11: • 14:51, June 20, 2012 (UTC) Okay I'll answer each with the correlating number: #The name can easily be changed, I think we should have a popular vote and see whether National Guard or Lovian Self-Defence Forces would win. #low flying is low flying, I need to insert a claus into the military law book that I forgot which states that any foriegn military in Lovia is bound by these laws. #I never intended to build one, more of have anti-air weaponry. Kunarian 04:03, June 21, 2012 (UTC)